• • • • I think substances will have to be handled by the coder, or be associated with species/race for a default -- FantoM

• There is no checking in the input for conflicting info. You can specify humanoid snake. There might have been a problem with one of the other values. The tool doesn't give any feedback if one of a set of values is invalid, just rejects them all.

• There is no checking in the input for conflicting info. You can specify humanoid snake.
• If you enter several values and one is invalid (doesn't exist) the tool doesn't give any feedback if one of a set of values is invalid, just rejects them all.

• • • Ishtar, and probably Styl, doesn't have special monsters, they just clone the generic "monster" and alter it's appearance. Some other areas do this a bit too. Unfortunately in the eyes of the tool they are all exactly the same thing. -- FantoM

• • Hall of Heros and the skeletons, etc. (Everything, but King of the Undead.)

• • Hall of Heros and the skeletons, etc.

• Harn (Though i doubt ALL the area was done. I'll have to verify it with Met.)

• Harn (Almost all. Chance of losing recorder going there. :( )

• Everything has a head unless you do nohead.

• Do these parts hold information of their substance? a flesh arm, clay torso (golems), wooden leg. The results of hitting a such part is very varied.
  • The flesh type of the monster should be the same all over - thus handling clay golems and stone trolls. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
  • The wooden leg is a special coder thing - lets not worry about it just now. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• Shouldn't there be a head to these basic shapes as well?
  • Everything has a head unless you do nohead.

• • Doesn't say much about their shape. Speach and AI should go elsewhere really (and todo) --Main.FreD

• It says 'upright' is a special option. If upright is a form, add it to the chart. Prime example i used lately was: "body dragon upright wings scales claws tail" BUT, it gave an ERROR because it doesn't allow for further input beyond 'upright.' I think upright should be on the chart and show the defaults as mentioned in the above note so people know what not to add (even though they can't add anything yet.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • There is no checking in the input for conflicting info. You can specify humanoid snake. There might have been a problem with one of the other values. The tool doesn't give any feedback if one of a set of values is invalid, just rejects them all -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
• Added 'body scorpion reptile leg6 claws notoes nofingers codertodo' recently. todo would be a value of pincers. Dictionary describes scorpion as a creature. -shrug- Snake didn't fit. Add value for pincers only. They have claws and pincers and a tail. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • I was thinking, could use this for generating skills and messages. If some kind of monster don't have a hand it should definately not use it to fight (it branches in current wierd messages for odd monsters).
  • Hmm - claws was meant to be pincers. but now that you mention the difference we should use it. Scorpions wouldn't have claws right? should have pincers. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
    • Added pincers -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
  • Added noarms to reptile in the table above so it's not necessary to specify it. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
• Add rodent and insect to chart. Add rodent to recorder body types aswell. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • Why no rodent? Decalaring everything under leg4 seems kinda wonky. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
    • But rodents are just small 4 legged things with a tail. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
• Add head to humanoid chart. I'd add these myself, but then maybe you'd forget to update the in-game code aswell. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • Head is on all things unless you put nohead. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
• Add value magical for creations. (ie. Golems, zombies.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • That is in the race of the thing, not the shape. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
• Add type nolegs to recorder. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
  • Snake not the right shape? I added nolegs. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
    • Well it was a wandering snowman. So maybe it DID have legs. Who knows. Also there are lots of mobs with no description at all, because the area is so old and pathetic, and its hard to gauge. I pointed out one to Prodigy earlier. I haven't checked his changes since then. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
      • Snowmen don't have legs - u r right. He must slide magically. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• Recorder needs option nofins for shellfish. Using 'noarms' as Fred suggested, though. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005
  • Added nofins as well -- FantoM

• You should really add insect and upright includes to the chart. And whatever other new things were added that weren't put on the chart yet. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005
  • Added insect. upright isn't a body type. it's a thing you apply. IE upright 6 legged thing or upright 4 legged thing. -- FantoM

• Avians should auto-include a tail. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005
  • Thoughts anyone? If we add it we have to revisit all the avians and do "notail" (which we don't currently have)) -- FantoM
  • Birds do have a tail-bone. I think bats have one too, but just a very short one (some might have longer). When we come to gargoyles and harpys, we don't have very many of those (todo) -- FreD
    • I already left off the tail on all the avians because it should be pre-set. And there aren't really all that many avians. Dragons, birds. There was only one thing that i can think of that probably +doesn't+ have a tail, and that's the wisp in Danaar. -- LuCid - 27 Feb 2005

• • • I'm pondering if there is any need to specify the "substance" for some creatures. Like stoneskin (some trolls), clayskin (some golems), iceskin (some more golems). It would have some effect on many things. If you like to severe a stoneskin monster with a standard knife would be pretty tough. Trolls would swim pretty badly, golems would dissolve in water and more; spells which can apply stoneskin or turn a target into ice (iceskin to cathegorize them as substance) I don't know yet how many monster need this, but it would definately make things more intresting (plus more fun code). -- FreD

• Avians should auto-include a tail. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005
  • Thoughts anyone? If we add it we have to revisit all the avians and do "notail" (which we don't currently have)) -- FantoM
    • I already left off the tail on all the avians because it should be pre-set. And there aren't really all that many avians. Dragons, birds. There was only one thing that i can think of that probably +doesn't+ have a tail, and that's the wisp in Danaar. -- LuCid - 27 Feb 2005

Thoughts

• If a creature is magical or not is a race thing, not the shape.
• Snowmen slide magically.
• Upright is a way of using your limbs, not a shape. IE upright 6 legged thing or upright 4 legged thing.
• There is no checking in the input for conflicting info. You can specify humanoid snake. There might have been a problem with one of the other values. The tool doesn't give any feedback if one of a set of values is invalid, just rejects them all.
• Not all avians have feathers, those who do, specify each case.

• Ishtar 0%
  • A bug made all creatures there humanoid, tail, winged, horns, szLarge (or someone joking around). This is in todo to separate them from the monster with mentioned shape.

• • • I already left off the tail on all the avians because it should be pre-set. And there aren't really all that many avians. Dragons, birds. There was only one thing that i can think of that probably +doesn't+ have a tail, and that's the wisp in Danaar. -- LuCid - 27 Feb 2005

• Harn (Though i doubt ALL the area was done. I'll have to verify it with Met.)

• When I went through labeling alot of area's I didnt describe a hands toes hooves claws for alot of things, so I started going through to re-define all these things and noticed that a "paws" attribute would be standard for jackals, dogs, etc., unless thats already included into leg4, and for that matter, is there anything assigned to adding of leg#, or should we be describing leg2 feet/hooves/pegs? -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005
  • Lets presume leg# implies foot + toes unless you add claws, hooves, paws, notoes. Thus spider would be leg8, notoes.
    • Added paws -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• I think another example of szSmall should be human children or humans with decriptions that state that they are small/short. I've used it sparingly when describing some humans, and a gnome. -- LuCid - 23 Feb 2005
  • Noted that someone turned goats to tiny. It should be small rather than tiny so very small, insect sized creatures can be cathegorized as tiny. Also there is some minor bugs with townspeople (especially tolnedra). Many of them share the same object file so if you set the children to be small you'll set the soldiers and beggars to small aswell. Easy to separate, and I'm working on it. But just so you know if you run into it and think someone is running around and setting ill-fitted bodies to people you might just run into a shared monster. -- FreD - 23 Feb 2005
  • I updated the definition of tiny & small in line with the above comments. Tiny is now handsized or smaller. -- FantoM

• • Added nofins as well -- FantoM

• • Added insect. upright isn't a body type. it's a thing you apply. IE upright 6 legged thing or upright 4 legged thing. -- FantoM

• • • Body shape is not only for combat. If I have a corpse we could use the hair/fur/scales bit to determine what you get when you skill it. -- FantoM

• • Thoughts anyone? If we add it we have to revisit all the avians and do "notail" (which we don't currently have)) -- FantoM

• Magnus' Tower (Area just s and west of wisdom trainers.)

• Magnus' Tower (Area just south and west of wisdom trainers.)

• That area on the west side of Towapath:

• That area on the west side of Towpath:

• • • One can clench something's hair as leverage in combat. -- LuCid - 27 Feb 2005

I'm compiling a list of recorded areas to help the recorders.

Completed areas:

• Tolnedra (I think we got everything. This area is quite large.)
• Magnus' Tower (Area just s and west of wisdom trainers.)
• Village of the Ancients
• Rift (The place where you climb down from the Towpath road. Has clockwise-type exits.)
• Towpath
• Areas off Chaos Tree:
  • Caemlyn (Including sub-areas.)
  • Q-zar
  • Asylum (Including prison, sewer, and the rest.)
  • Warcraft (incomplete.)
• Danarr 90% Complete
  • Treants
  • Troll (orges, all land wanderers.)
  • Wiztower
  • Forgotten Tempple
  • Dark Caverns
  • Krestle Keep (incomplete.)
• East of Tolnedra:
  • Peat Bog
  • Koi in pond.
  • Playdoh Area tree with squirrels (Through portal.)
• Riva
• Bismarck
• Dwarven Outpost
• Elfrea (All sub-areas too.)
• Karak-Azul
• That area on the west side of Towapath:
  • Zalpur
  • Cloud palace
  • Every area over here. I don't know their callnames.
• All the areas northwest of Towpath:
  • Hall of Heros and the skeletons, etc. (Everything, but King of the Undead.)
  • Monks
  • Minotaurs
  • Snow dragon
  • Robed ones

Remaining areas unconfirmed. I'm checking them all myself to make sure they are all correct. I've spent a couple hours each day.

The recorders: Jinx (Ninja,) Metallica, Poeun (Cuddles, me.) -- LuCid - 27 Feb 2005

• Avians should auto-include a tail. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005

• • Hair isn't important enough in my eyes. It wouldn't do you much good having hair when you get hit by a truck would it? Neither does fur I suppose, Im still thinking this over -- FreD

• There should be a 'hair' setting. Fur doesn't always make sense. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005

• • • Another question I had, will -leg2 remove leg2 off the base of a reptile (leg4,tail) or will that only

* Another question I had, will -leg2 remove leg2 off the base of a reptile (leg4,tail) or will that only subtract if a leg2 attribute was added extra? -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• Recorder needs option nofins for shellfish. Using 'noarms' as Fred suggested, though. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005

• You should really add insect and upright includes to the chart. And whatever other new things were added that weren't put on the chart yet. -- LuCid - 26 Feb 2005

• • • Does upright imply a leg4 -leg2 arm2? I marked most dragons as upright with tail winged and now I will be going back through re-labeling them "body dragon reptile upright winged tail scales claws -leg2 arm2". Another question I had, will -leg2 remove leg2 off the base of a reptile (leg4,tail) or will that only subtract if a leg2 attribute was added extra? -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• • • Does upright imply a leg4 -leg2 arm2? I marked most dragons as upright with tail winged and now I will be going back through re-labeling them "body dragon reptile upright winged tail scales claws -leg2 arm2". * Upright implies that 2 of the legs function as arms some percentage of the time. You still need to specify how many legs it has. -- FantoM
    • Another question I had, will -leg2 remove leg2 off the base of a reptile (leg4,tail) or will that only

• • I updated the definition of tiny & small in line with the above comments. Tiny is now handsized or smaller. -- FantoM

• • Noted that someone turned goats to tiny. It should be small rather than tiny so very small, insect sized creatures can be cathegorized as tiny. Also there is some minor bugs with townspeople (especially tolnedra). Many of them share the same object file so if you set the children to be small you'll set the soldiers and beggars to small aswell. Easy to separate, and I'm working on it. But just so you know if you run into it and think someone is running around and setting ill-fitted bodies to people you might just run into a shared monster. -- FreD - 23 Feb 2005

• I think another example of szSmall should be human children or humans with decriptions that state that they are small/short. I've used it sparingly when describing some humans, and a gnome. -- LuCid - 23 Feb 2005

Sizes are now supported, use the table below to get the right value. Don't worry if you feel you are out by a bit.

Sizes are now supported, use the table below to get the right value. Don't worry if you feel you are out by a bit. If the size is omitted then its presumably medium.

Sizes are now supported, use the table below to get the right value. Don't worry if you feel you are out by a bit.

• size
  • one of 7 cathegories, szTiny (cat, dogs, rats), szSmall (dwarf), szMedium (human), szLarge (ogre), szHuge (giants), szGargantuan (huge seasnakes, five floor buildings), szColossal (vast dragons, humongous creatures, like dinosaurs).
    • Size should be an attribute added to the tool so we can kill two birds with one stone, collect body shapes and size at the same time. -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• • Everything has a head unless you do nohead.

• • • But rodents are just small 4 legged things with a tail. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • • • Snowmen don't have legs - u r right. He must slide magically. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • Lets presume leg# implies foot + toes unless you add claws, hooves, paws, notoes. Thus spider would be leg8, notoes.
    • Added paws -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • • Does upright imply a leg4 -leg2 arm2? I marked most dragons as upright with tail winged and now I will be going back through re-labeling them "body dragon reptile upright winged tail scales claws -leg2 arm2". Another question I had, will -leg2 remove leg2 off the base of a reptile (leg4,tail) or will that only subtract if a leg2 attribute was added extra? -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• • • Size should be an attribute added to the tool so we can kill two birds with one stone, collect body shapes and size at the same time. -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• When I went through labeling alot of area's I didnt describe a hands toes hooves claws for alot of things, so I started going through to re-define all these things and noticed that a "paws" attribute would be standard for jackals, dogs, etc., unless thats already included into leg4, and for that matter, is there anything assigned to adding of leg#, or should we be describing leg2 feet/hooves/pegs? -- TuKaN - 22 Feb 2005

• • one of 7 cathegories, szTiny (cat, dogs, rats), szSmall (dwarf), szMedium (human), szLarge (ogre), szHuge (giants), szGargantuan (huge seasnakes, five floor buildings), szColossal (vast dragons, humongous creatures, like dinosaurs).

• • • Well there are generic humans, and then there are humans with Capitalizations and actual names (ie NPCs.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005

• • Why no rodent? Decalaring everything under leg4 seems kinda wonky. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005

• • • Well it was a wandering snowman. So maybe it DID have legs. Who knows. Also there are lots of mobs with no description at all, because the area is so old and pathetic, and its hard to gauge. I pointed out one to Prodigy earlier. I haven't checked his changes since then. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005

There is now a body all command to list the details of all monsters in the room, this is useful for determining what has yet to be done.

• • The flesh type of the monster should be the same all over - thus handling clay golems and stone trolls. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
  • The wooden leg is a special coder thing - lets not worry about it just now. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• A command for listing the details of all monsters in the room.

• • You mean human vs humanoid? -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • I left them off as bats and similiar things don't have feathers. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • There is no checking in the input for conflicting info. You can specify humanoid snake. There might have been a problem with one of the other values. The tool doesn't give any feedback if one of a set of values is invalid, just rejects them all -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • Hmm - claws was meant to be pincers. but now that you mention the difference we should use it. Scorpions wouldn't have claws right? should have pincers. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
    • Added pincers -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005
  • Added noarms to reptile in the table above so it's not necessary to specify it. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • Head is on all things unless you put nohead. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • That is in the race of the thing, not the shape. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • Snake not the right shape? I added nolegs. -- FantoM - 22 Feb 2005

• • I was thinking, could use this for generating skills and messages. If some kind of monster don't have a hand it should definately not use it to fight (it branches in current wierd messages for odd monsters).

• Maybe add NPC or Mob to the Humanoid value. (This could be useful later on when deciding on monster behaviours and speech patterns.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Shouldn't avian's include feathers? -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• It says 'upright' is a special option. If upright is a form, add it to the chart. Prime example i used lately was: "body dragon upright wings scales claws tail" BUT, it gave an ERROR because it doesn't allow for further input beyond 'upright.' I think upright should be on the chart and show the defaults as mentioned in the above note so people know what not to add (even though they can't add anything yet.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Added 'body scorpion reptile leg6 claws notoes nofingers codertodo' recently. todo would be a value of pincers. Dictionary describes scorpion as a creature. -shrug- Snake didn't fit. Add value for pincers only. They have claws and pincers and a tail. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Add rodent and insect to chart. Add rodent to recorder body types aswell. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Add head to humanoid chart. I'd add these myself, but then maybe you'd forget to update the in-game code aswell. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Add value magical for creations. (ie. Golems, zombies.) -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005
• Add type nolegs to recorder. -- LuCid - 22 Feb 2005

• Do these parts hold information of their substance? a flesh arm, clay torso (golems), wooden leg. The results of hitting a such part is very varied.
• size

• Shouldn't there be a head to these basic shapes aswell?

Body shape overview

• See 'body shapes' for the full list.
• All things are presumed to have a head, unless nohead is given.
• You should try to choose one of the "base" shapes from the table below and alter it as necessary by adding other shapes

• Note that arms implies hands and hands implies fingers. to alter this the nohands and nofingers attributes exist.
• Ditto with legs implying feet and toes and the nofeet and hooves attributes.
• Torso implies arms and legs
• Head implies eyes, ears and brain
• Upright is a special one implying that 2 of the legs are used for walking and as arms.
  • Eg rabbits, dragons, kangaroos and scorpions.

Parts yet to handle

• beaks: could add to avian, need to check what has been labled as avian, if dragons then we have to provide a nobeak. Do dragons have a beak?

Body types and what they include (keep in mind all things are assumed to have heads):

Arachnid - many legs, many eyes, torso (Spiders and uhhhh... etc.)

Avian - torso, wings, leg2, (Bird creatures)

Leg4 - leg4 (four legs), torso, (Such as dogs, deer, etc.)

Snake - torso, tail (Snakes, worms, etc.)

Reptile - torso, leg4, tail, scales (Lizards, crocodiles, etc.)

Humanoid - leg2, arm2, torso (Physical demons, skeletons, trolls, etc.)

Upright - torso, leg2, arm2 (Rabbits, dragons, marsupials, etc.)

Fish - torso, tail, fins (Any fish-like creature)

Codertodo - Elemental/spirit creatures

As for the attributes, Im not sure the full list just yet.

Body types and what they include (keep in mind all things are assumed to have heads):

Arachnid - many legs, many eyes, torso (Spiders and uhhhh... etc.)

Avian - torso, wings, leg2, (Bird creatures)

Leg4 - leg4 (four legs), torso, (Such as dogs, deer, etc.)

Snake - torso, tail (Snakes, worms, etc.)

Reptile - torso, leg4, tail, scales (Lizards, crocodiles, etc.)

Humanoid - leg2, arm2, torso (Physical demons, skeletons, trolls, etc.)

Upright - torso, leg2, arm2 (Rabbits, dragons, marsupials, etc.)

Fish - torso, tail, fins (Any fish-like creature)

Codertodo - Elemental/spirit creatures

As for the attributes, Im not sure the full list just yet.

%META:TOPICINFO{author="FantoM" date="1108955820" format="1.0" version="1.1"}% %META:TOPICPARENT{name="ObjectLibrary"}% As part of the building of an object library for the mud we need to gather details about the state of things already in play.

The tool /players/fantom/obj/recorder/recorder.c can be used by players to record the shape of all the monsters in the mud.

The tool provides the 'body' command and should be used when in the room with a monster for whom the details need to be recorded.

The command body <monster> lists the existing details of the monster.

The command body <monster> humanoid tail horns hooves would define monster as being humanoid (head/torso/arms/legs) with a tail, horns and hooves.

The command body <monster> -tail noears would remove the tail and add noears.

All changes are logged.

Add suggestions below.

-- FantoM - 21 Feb 2005

Suggestions:

• A command for listing the monsters in the room who don't have any details.
• A command for listing the details of all monsters in the room.